008: Worst + Best Professors

Millie: Hey guys its Millie again!

Gabi: its Gabi!

M: And we are so excited for another week of Change By Degrees. We’ve had tons of fun. And we have maybe a little bit of a venting episode today.

G: Definitely.

M: I think a venting moment is coming.

G: So, our question for you today is your worst and your best professors. We will be discussing bad professors and what makes a professor bad, I mean, this is kind of all subjective, but good professors and what makes a professor really really good, and makes you enjoy the class. So that is our discussion for today, so Millie, what is your experience with professors? Let’s just go through that.

M: Okay, they’re a rare kind. We’re gonna call them that.

G: They are.

M: I honestly, there’s really old ones, there’s super young ones. The TA, the wanna be professors.

G: Those are the different kind, the young and the old.

M: We have all sorts. I’ve had a math class with an Indian professor that, like, you don’t understand jack squat. I think, which one first, worst or best? I think worst, I mean, I have shared about my really horrible singing class and that very discouraging—I’m being nice by saying discouraging.

G: That’s a very nice term. Discouraging professor.

M: And I had a math professor who didn’t want to teach. He didn’t want to be at Mason anymore. So, he thought it would be better to draw political cartoons on the whiteboard for, like, half an hour and then let the class out early.

G: Which is super super productive. It’s calculus; let’s draw political cartoons.

M: It was good, I learned tons. And best, I actually had a few pretty good professors. I was a part of a classical guitar ensemble. And I really liked him, he valued growth above all, like, he knew we aren’t all guitar masters, and so he took me where I was at, and if I grew throughout the semester I got an A. and I was like, ‘Thank you sir, can I have you for every single one of my classes?’ But yeah, other than that they’ve been pretty normal I would say. Pretty standard. I don’t know, did you have interesting professors?

G: Yeah, I had, well, I’ll start with the bad ones, I guess. Just because we can end on a good note. I had, and this might be kind of, okay, I’m bad at math. Disclaimer, so the professor that I had that I did not enjoy having was a math professor. So, I can’t really fault him. This is my experience with math professors, at least, me: they know what they’re talking about, they know their thing, they just don’t know how to teach it to someone who is, like, lost. And it’s not like I was taking a higher—I only needed two math credits.

M: It was calculus, right?

G: No, it wasn’t calculus, it was below that. It was like math 110. It was like, I think it was called elementary mathematics. Or no, it was contemporary mathematics. And it was an hour 15 minutes.

M: What was it?

G: I don’t know what it was. I think it was algebra, I say I think because I got a D in the class. So, I’m not completely sure what it was. But it was contemporary mathematics, and that was the worst class of that semester, probably out of my whole college career. But I did have good professors though. And um, well, two actually come to mind. My Arabic professor—shout out to Dr. Obeid, she’s the only Arabic professor at CNU.

M: Name drop.

G: But I love her, I absolutely, like, adore her. She is brilliant, she’s fantastic, and I had her for two years, and she was, like, so humble. I think a lot of times we get professors that know their field really well, but they’re super arrogant a little bit, and they come across like they know everything, and you’re supposed to sit and learn. Which is like, yes, you’re supposed to teach me, but at the same time it should be like a give and take kind of thing. I think professors who set the tone in the classroom as like, ‘Well I’m here to learn about you and what you have to say,’ is like super nice and that’s how she was. She was just super awesome. And then all my English professors were like amazing.

M: All of them.

G: Yeah, I can’t single out one, they’re just all amazing.

M: I can say the same thing about my music teachers for the most part. I’ve had some horrendous ones, but I had one last semester, I forgot. He was French, he was totally new, he had no idea what he was doing, he was just hired, and he was like, ‘I don’t know what I’m doing, guys.’ That’s my best French accent. Fail. But what I really liked is that he tried something new every day. And he was willing to learn about the student and what we wanted to learn. And he wanted to structure the class around what we wanted to learn. And it was like, I don’t know if it qualified as a class, but its on my transcript, so.

G: So, it does qualify.

M: So, it does. And it was fun, and it was a unique experience to say the least, and I. think he’s coming back for this semester. So, you know what, go professor. He was the most non-professor professor I’ve had. 

G: the kind that is like super chill about everything. Whatever about it. I had one professor say, ‘I’m only giving you a grade because I have to. If it was up to me, it would just be a class that you learn and have fun.’ But he was like ‘I have to give you a grade because CNU tells me I have to so, here’s your grade.’ And he pretty much passed everyone except for the people who literally didn’t do the work and didn’t show up or put effort in. but everyone who was putting in effort and like you said earlier, displayed growth throughout the semester, he was like, ‘Yeah that’s what I’m looking for. I don’t want to make this class something that is like, just numbers.’ Like ok you got 5/10 correct on this test, but he wanted to get to know you and stuff like that. It was really really nice.

M: So, when you think about what makes a good professor, what are the qualities that you’re looking for, and what makes a good professor?

G: I would say professors who are humble enough to learn from you as well, and that’s how my Arabic professor was and she had said, she was like, ‘You’re going to make mistakes with this language and learning it, and the pronunciation and the spelling; I’m still gonna make mistakes too. Like I’m gonna make mistakes with my English or just mistakes in general.’ Because like, professors slip up and they spell something wrong on the board, or they give you a wrong test date, or whatever. And it’s like, she’s like, ‘If you have grace for me, I’ll have grace for you.’ We are all in this together, kind of thing. But it was really cool that she was able to be humble enough to say that to us, and most of my English professors were like that too. They were willing to learn from us too, and it was discussion-based classes and they were so like gracious that we took their class in the first place, and it was really nice.

M: that is nice. But we did want to leave you with a little practical tip. Because before you go into a class, there’s a really good website you can check out. It’s called ratemyprofessor.com. I know it helped me.

G: It saved my life so many times

M: for me honestly sometimes you don’t find your professor, but most of the time you do, the thing is, in the music school, my choices are slim, like I have one professor for this class and I can’t pick, but at least you can like see going in from other students like they really like compliments or turn things in on time, or whatever. Little tips so you at least know what to expect. Even if it doesn’t help you pick. Sometimes it did help me pick on some of my computer science classes. But also, don’t believe it all the way. I’ve had some students who are on there who are like, ‘This professor was horrible. My life sucked.’ And it’s like well you didn’t do the work. So just with a grain of salt, but I think it can be a really useful tool. In addition, I know Mason, I don’t know if CNU does it, but you fill out these surveys at the end of the class, and you log in online, and you can see based on the surveys, and I usually trash all my professors, not the, okay, brutally honest.

G: You said you had a few good ones.

M: I did, and by the end of it, I’m usually like 5, 5, 5, 5, 1, 5, 5.

G: If it’s a really good professor, like I will spend my time writing it out. But if it’s a bad professor, I’m going to tell them they’re a bad professor, but if it’s a good professor, or if he or she is an average professor, I’m like whatever they probably get the same rating every semester because everyone has the same opinion. But if it was a fantastic professor, I’m like 5, 5, 5, 5, 5, I adore you, I just love. Because those are the professors you want to stick around and have other students take classes from them.

M: And not have their life suck.

G: Right, but ratemyprofessor is a life saver honestly.

M: You can avoid some disastrous situations real quick. Just log on for two seconds and check it out.

G: I feel like a lot of people, that’s becoming more popular to do. I mean, it might depend on the school, but most college students I’ve talked to are like yeah, ratemyprofessor is. So, any incoming freshman, look it up for next semester when registering for classes. Especially if you have options.

M: when you get your course list, log on, find your professors, and go from there. Because that takes more than just the time, because even if the class is an inconvenient time, sometimes taking the better professor will really make it worth it. So, I’m like, I will take this inconvenient time to get this better professor.

G: Right, if it means it’s going to make your life easier, then just do it.

M: So, what are some tips for dealing with a bad professor?

G: Well, one that I have found that is a little, I don’t know if you would call it a tip, but it’s to just grin and bear it. Your professors are the ones, you have to keep in mind, they grade your papers, they grade your tests, they give you participation points or don’t give you participation points, so when you have a bad professor and you don’t like this professor at all, or maybe you have a good professor, just for some reason you don’t like them, just suck it up because they control your grade, so even if you really hate the class and you’re not wanting to try, just give the allusion that you are trying your best because once again, they have control over your grade. So, I mean don’t try to fight them every step of the way because ultimately, they have the upper hand and if it’s a class you know you can get through, just the professor is kind of sucky then…

M: Just think about it—it will end. Just try to make it end so you don’t have to retake it. Put in that extra effort. I had a theory class and it was an older lady, very old, and she thought I was a horrible student. But even more than like, my assignments, it’s like being interested in the class. She really wanted to see engagement more than anything else because she thought we all just wanted to not be there, which was true, and like, she had a very bad outlook on this whole generation, like we don’t work at all, and I was like ma’am. Let me not lose myself. But she really appreciated seeing effort from me. Like I would ask how I did on an assignment, and like try to seem engaged. So, I think the allusion piece, even if you’re not feeling it, can help because she didn’t fail me. She thought to give me a pretty decent grade, even though she hated me, I’m so sorry ma’am. Thank you for passing me.

G: But that’s the thing, just, and once again, even if it’s inconvenient to do so, is going to office hours or something to show the professor that you are trying a little bit and it’s like if they see you trying, they might also be willing to go the extra mile to help you. Even if you don’t get along, they’re just wanting to see that students are trying. Most professors do, some professors literally don’t care. But most are willing to meet you halfway. And I think that’s what you have to do with a professor in a situation where you are either struggling in the class or you are struggling with this professor’s personality or teaching style or whatever. Also, sometimes, it’s just like getting help from other students to improve your grade. You don’t even have to talk to your professor. Just be like, ‘You know what, can you help me so my grade improves next test and so the professor sees that I am improving?’ if you really don’t want to go talk to your professor.

M: Get those phone numbers at the beginning of class.

G: Sit next to the kid who knows what’s happening.

M: Exactly. Oh, my goodness, you feel terrible about yourself, but then you’re like, ‘Well, at least I know this person.’ I think for me, good or bad professors, dealing with them has helped me deal with situations outside of college because like you said relying on other people who aren’t the professor, and I also learned from my math class or the theory class, you can’t rely on the professor to help you though everything and what is most important is growth. Do you feel the same way that at least dealing with those tough professors have helped?

G: Yeah, I think it has, I think a lot of students don’t really have the experience of dealing with difficult people until they get to college and then they’re on their own. So sometimes I think for people it can be like, not a shock, but like, I don’t know what to do, or whatever. It’s almost kind of a practice run before you get into the real world.

M: Like, you’re not babied, they’re adults, and you’re an adult dealing with adult to adult relationships.

G: And it’s not like you’re at school for 8 hours a day and then all of a sudden, your mom is like, ‘Okay you gotta go talk to your teacher after school.’ And then you do, it’s like you’re the person who has to walk your butt to the building and go into their office and be like, ‘Can I have a minute with you?’ Or email them, you hate emails. But emailing them and scheduling, ‘Can I come to your office at 8am and can we have a half hour conversation?’ You have to be the one to reach out. Because they’re not gonna reach out to you most of the time and be like, ‘Hey do you need help in this class? You failed the last exam.’ They’re just gonna be like, ‘Okay she failed, I don’t care.’ Whereas in high school you had teachers who were like, ‘I’m gonna call her mom and see if everything is okay at home.’ Like these people don’t care, some of them probably do, but they don’t have time to reach out to every individual student and ask them if everything is okay. You have to be willing to take the initiative in college, and like, in the real world it kinda helps you be a little bit more responsible and assertive, because you know that no one is going to do it for you.

M: That’s true. Because I struggle so much with assertion, but sometimes having to walk into an office and be like, ‘sir maybe you graded my paper wrong.’ That’s a tough piece, you can’t be chicken. There was one where I think there was a few points on some of the previous quizzes, but this theory professor, this lady who like she did these pop quizzes that were like 10 questions a piece. And she wouldn’t write them down, you had to write it on a sheet of paper, she would say the questions and then not remember what she asked, and then graded them.

G: Which is the perfect system.

M: it was very antiquated, and it was a mood. I was really not understanding what my life meant at that point. But we did these pop quizzes, and I knew I had the right question, but she would mark one off, and i’d be like, ‘Okay it’s fine. These quizzes don’t count for much of my grade, is it worth it?’ but then one time she gave me a 30, and I was like, ‘Ma’am I did not miss these 7.’ And actually, here’s how complicate the situation was. If I can do it anyone can because I was like poopin’ myself because I was so scared, man. I was so scared. I was like, I know I didn’t get all these wrong. I went to another student, okay there’s two people I have to talk to here. There’s not just one person I have to worry about. And I was like, ‘Hey’ who I barely knew, because I talk to no one. So I saw her answers were marked correct so I was like, ‘Okay could you like come up with me to this professor’ and I’m like, ‘Ma’am, do you see how this is right but for me it was wrong,’ and she was like, she gave me an extra point back and corrected the grade. And that was like, I took a nap for like 3 days.

G: Yeah, because you have to go up to the professor, and I’ve had it before where like, ‘You’re wrong.’ Not saying it that way but wording it in a way being like, ‘I don’t know maybe my handwriting, or like well, this is what I meant.’ Not accusing them. But once again, everyone makes mistakes, they could have just been making a mistake.

M: This is true.

G: But just being like, ‘Hey I noticed that someone else got the exact same answer and they got it marked right,’ or whatever. And I had to do that with one of my papers which is a little bit like, I mean, that can go either way because when you’re writing a paper you can’t be like, ‘Hey, I think I should get this.’ It’s not like, a right or wrong answer, it’s like, ‘I think I explained what you wanted me to but you obviously don’t think that.’ So, we go back and forth, and we argue and argue and argue, not argue, but present our sides.

M: Deliberate.

G: Yes, but like, it pays off. Sometimes you walk out, and professor is like, ‘No, that’s your final grade.’ And you’re like, ‘Okay, bye, thanks.’ And sometimes, like one time, I walked out and he raised my paper a whole letter grade.

M: Try.

G: So, it depends on the professor, and try, it just shows that you do care, even if you walk out and nothing has changed. Like if you still had that 30 percent or whatever, they’ll remember who you are and remember your name, which is super important, and they’ll remember that you took the time to argue your point or your side, and that you really care about your grade. That especially matters if it’s in your field. Like if it’s a random math class, it doesn’t matter as much, or a class that is outside of your field, but if it’s a class in your major, because you might have to take that professor again.

M: Show that you care.

G: Yeah, just show the department as a whole that you care.

M: You just reminded me, I did, that’s so important, because who wants to get up early on a Friday morning? Apparently, me, because mason is like, a half hour drive with traffic, over an hour. But this singing professor who hated me, he had office hours at 7:30 in the morning.

G: That just goes to show you he is expecting no one to show up though.

M: true, but for the kids who stayed there. No one wanted to get up that early, like I have to commute, so I got up at 5:30 so I could be ready and not look like I’m high or something, so I could go into these office hours because he held them at 7:30 in the morning and every Monday, Wednesday, Friday, I would get up and, not to get a grade, he would just want to sing an exercise that we would be doing in class, just to hear me, and I’m like, okay whatever. But I was consistent, and I passed the class, and I think in the end, even though I don’t hate him, just strongly dislike him, he seemed to like me and validate that I had grown in the class. Because I thought at some point that this dude hated me. But after 3 semesters of getting up to go sing for this dude, in that office hours, like it made a difference. Sometimes I would cry coming out of his office hours, like fail, but it makes a difference. So, show the effort, and some people may acknowledge it, or they might not, but still you know that you put in the effort.

G: And sometimes that’s what gets you the grade. It’s like you might literally suck at everything you turn in, but if the professor sees that you’re trying, then that’s what gets you the grade. And people tell you all the time, ‘Professors don’t play favorites.’ Yes, they do. They so do. They so play favorites, dude. And if they really like you,

M: They so do.

G: If they see you trying, they will give you the grade. So many times, I’ve had classes where I’m like, ‘Yeah, I did not deserve this grade. I know I don’t deserve this grade.’ Because I went to their office hours, or I had a random conversation with them 5 minutes after class one time. It’s just little stuff like that, but its super personable. Like, they’re people, like they like to be talked to and they like when people suck up, let’s be honest.

M: you can learn the power of a compliment early. What effort does it take? Because you can use that anywhere, when you’re in an interview, later on.

G: Interviews, yeah, you gotta suck up a lot. So, you know, is it the best thing ever to suck up, no. but if that’s the way the education system is set up then I’m gonna play the game. I’m gonna play the game for the rest of my life.

M: That’s too funny. But those are some of the great experiences with all these variety of professors. And mason and CNU don’t have the only, there are so many other universities, so id really love to hear your experiences with professors. Good, bad, in between, all the things.

G: Any experiences you’ve had with professors, definitely reach out to us.

M: We really want to hear. That was it for this episode. We hope you enjoyed this one. Bye!

G: Bye!